Price Slashing out of control

[hookupz]

I don't really have as much time to check prices as much as I used to but I went on Goped Index and was upset when I saw a few things. Now I am both a Ada Racing and Sikk Toys dealer and I enjoy doing business with both companies. I have been a ADA dealer for years and a Sikk toys dealer for around a year now. I have done a lot of business with ADA which has started to slow down in the recent months. What upset me a few minutes ago was when I saw the price of their 27cc bore kits. Now Sikk Toys does not sell direct to the public which is a nice convinience to their dealers. It makes them want to actually try to sell their products because they know they can actually make a sale. Ada racing offers their products on their own website direct to the public so the questions come up in my head like, why buy from a dealer when you could get it from ADA at around the same price? They war with prices has gotten so out of control its not even funny. Now I know ADA can make some money selling bore kits for 49.99 but how can their dealers? Why be an ADA dealer if you cant even compete with your supplier. It would be like me trying to sell water cheaper then Alhambra, it just wouldn't work. If I bought a month ago 50 bore kits from ADA I would be in trouble right now, I would not be able to sell them because I paid more for them at that time then they are selling them for right now. I would have to actually loose money just to get rid of them. I have enjoyed doing business with ADA but the current practices and "war" that they have with Sikk Toys needs to stop. This is going to be the downfall of a market that was once thriving. MAP pricing was and is a good idea and I think everyone should be using it, including Sikk Toys. MAP pricing controls the market and helps keep it alive. It keeps websites out there from under pricing eachother until no money can be made. How can shops stay alive if they are getting undersold left and right? There are so called shops out there that are only websites ran out of someones garage that sell parts for cheap because they don't have any rent to pay or utilities other then their home. Shops like mine that have a retail location, local customers, a service dept, and a website can not survive. Don't get me wrong, I am not hurting in any way other then when I see my suppliers out doing me. I trust them to supply me with the best resources that they have to push their products but why push their products when they will out do you every time. Am I complaining? Yes, and I know other dealers feel it as well. For almost a year now I have watched items from ADA racing products become available to the public several days before they become available to dealers. I have seen prices drop significatly without notice or reason.

I am glad that companies like ADA and Sikk Toys are coming out with high quality products that are cheaper in price, its about time some one stepped up.

[YzAssracing.com]

it's about time!

You know I totally agree with you 100%! I am getting into the motorsports business & have found from talking to many many dealers that it's near impossible to sell some products. Sure it's ok if they sell their own products, but where's the incentive to have dealers sell them? Originally I asked for a ADA dealer request form, but later decided against it. Their products are awesome, but like you said " why go to a dealer when they can eliminate the middle man"? The need to figure out something so the people that did buy tons of ADA parts aren't freaking out now because they can't sell them for even a small profit. I'am not kissing a$$ here either. It's hard to get started in any business let alone when the conditions are like this. I hope this situation gets resumed sooner than later. Thanks for pointing this out, somebody needed to. ADA keep up the good work, just save something for the rest of us!

[Brooks]

Yes, things were fine before other companies decided that the only way they could come into the market was with undercutting prices. Now, I am sitting here with shelves full of Superior products. Remember, I buy from Superior, just as you other dealers buy from Sikk. If you can buy a motor for the same price that I can, how can I sell them to you? The only avenue I have left to sell these products is to go retail. Otherwise, all I have is a whole lotta paper weights.

The scooter industry as a whole is getting messed up, including the billet stuff. New players come in and the only way they think that they can sell their product is by having lower prices. It is up to the dealers who they are going to buy from. As long as they keep feeding these new guys, profit margins will stay low. Everyone seems buys for price, not service or quality.

Maybe when I clear my shelves of this Taiwanese stuff, I'll leave the space for other things.

[Sick Shift]

Originally posted by Brooks
The scooter industry as a whole is getting messed up

It has already, and is getting worse everyday.

[SyNdRomE]

...aDa is The best... But should try to work something out with there dealers :-/... PUT THE g260 engine on ur site so i can buy it!

[motoxracer]

as the buyer i am certainly not complaining. and i think its about time. how could a goped pipe be as much as a dirtbike pipe. and how could a bbk be as much as dirtbike piston head. and this situation that u all r in should be switched with gas companies. and have gas prices be tiny.

[pedhead7]

I dont Mind the Low Prices. Just gotta make Shure I order over $100 For Free Shipping.

[hookupz]

Shipping will always be like that at Hookupz. The problem is that you can get the same deal from ADA so why buy from Hookupz, or any other ADA dealer. I used to do so much business with ADA buying 20 to 30 HE23HP motors at a time 3-5 times a month. I used to spend a lot of money with them. When I started paying close attention noticing that my main competitor was the same company selling me the product I thought this is a lose lose situation for me so I stopped spending all that money. I am in this business to have fun and make some money selling parts and scooters. Its what I like to do. Goped shut me out after all the money I spent with them and it was the best thing that ever happened to my business. I used to save them hundreds on shipping by going to pick up my scooters from the factory and no thanks did I ever receive, they dropped me like a bad habbit. since I started spending money with ADA who has products that are better priced I can pass that on to my customer and in turn save them some money as well. Goped was greedy and they didnt want their dealers doing anything but buying from them. I beleive that ADA does not care to much for their dealers anymore and it shows in their practices. In the past several months I have not paid much attention because I am used to how Meyer and Sikk Toys treats me when I talk to them. Oh look at that UPS just got here with 3 boxes full of motors, wonder where I got them from??? The world is changing in the Scooter Industry, it will be interesting to see where some of these companies will be at this time next year.

[Slimcandy428]

So whats the bottom line in your opinion? You like what Ada is doing or...?


Btw, I agree with you on the PWM thing.

[Jeff23]

Jerad, screw goped. I think that you are definitly heading in the right direction. I think you definitly made the right choice to start carrying boxer. Boxer is going places goped is not. I have ordered from hookupz many times and the service and prices are great. About the whole ada thing.. i dont know what to say. A year ago people would laugh if you said you had a 29cc motor. For under 250 none the less. good luck in the future..

Jeff Stutz

[harix]

This kind of funny, because Hookupz is the one violate MAP all the times. I'm also a dealer and I know which dealer sell cheap.

But ADA, see what happen if you're sell MAP yourself. You may sell, but not as much as dealer buy. Other than that, many dealer closing because of you, and you will overstock parts. Well...

[motoxracer]

y would ada care about dealers when they got the money and the custumers. and what do u mean goped is going no where. look at all the new stuff ada and all the rest of the companies have come up with. the day that goped goes out of buissness is the day that i stop peding

[hookupz]

If I have anything that MAP pricing does not match it is because of a change in pricing that was done with out me being told. I do not receive price updates and I do not have time to go weekly and make sure my prices are in accordance with MAP pricing. I run a full service shop unlike most of the other online dealers I run across. I built this business myself starting when I was age 21 with $4000 to my name going into it. I do not step on anyones feet, I give everyone a good deal regardless of who they are and I dont price gouge other dealers. I start out selling each product at a decent retail price and other dealers out there decide they want to knock the price down so I adjust to stay competitive. In my opinion if a company is going to do MAP pricing which they all should then they need to notify dealers when the pricing has changed so each dealer can make changed to their websites acordingly. I dont make up the rules but I try to follow them as close as I can. I do a pretty damn good job running a full service shop, very busy online store and a discussion forum all by myself. I do not have any employees at all other then myself. I work 7 days a week at a minimum of 8 hours a day sometimes working as much as 2 days in a row with out sleep to get my work done, orders out and scooters repaired. If I do not get a MAP price updated right away or something gets added and is 50 cents off the MAP price and you feel the need to complain about it then Im sorry. If I buy a part from ada one day and sikk toys the other and the price differs on the website then you should check both companies, one of them I am obiding by. If you could get a HE23HP motor from someone else for cheaper but it was called a ST23HP (they are the same motor down to the last bolt) for cheaper one week then you would do it, its called smart business practice and also avoiding a 100 kids calling asking what a ST23HP motor is just so you could tell them its the same damn thing as the HE23HP. Maybe when you take on as much of the industries business as I do and still have 99.9% of your customers sing praises to your name then I will care what you think. Since you have the time you should go through my whole website for me and let me know what needs to be fixed, I have some stickers and a tank skin I will send you for your time.
Thanks for your enlightening commentary but on the plus side you do see what Im talking about as your second comment to ADA is 100% correct. If they didnt sell direct to public think of how much more stuff we would have to buy from them to make up for it. If they didnt cut prices on their own inventory lower then we could sell it for think about where our profit margines would be right now. They would be higher then they are now which is in the gutter...

My main complaint is in the price war to out do eachother when you are basically selling the same thing. If ADA took care of me even 1% maybe I would have never called Sikk Toys in the first place. If you have not noticed any changes in the industry lately then you obviously are not selling much.

[motoxracer]

a true buissness man

and hey i like all the movies on ur site

[Brooks]

We do not sell at MAP price, we sell at our suggested retail. 3 items that we sell that are the same as Sikk, motors, big bore, and +1mm stuffer stroker, do not have a MAP price, as Sikk does not have MAP. When Sikk lets their dealers like Oneill Brothers sell big bore kits for $49.99 on their website, what can we do? I've got hundreds of these things.

As far as price changes go, I don't know of any sure-fire way of notifying our dealers. We change the price in our dealer shopping cart, we change the dealer price list that is downloadable in our dealer cart, and yes we change the price on our retail website, which most seem to notice first. Plus, I usually try to post something in here, the Billet Board. Other than calling or faxing every single dealer, I don't know what else can be done. Most of our dealers order from our online dealer cart, so they would then see the price. Yes, I agree, we could change the dealer price 1st and then a week or so later drop the retail. That is something that we have talked about. Unfortunately, our dealers don't give us much feedback, they just jump ship. We are always open to suggestions, especially from our dealers. Dealers are a majority of our business. But, we will always sell retail. We were selling retail on the interent before almost all, if not all, of the current dealers were in this business or selling on the interent themselves. We started out retail and grew into dealer sales.

All of the products that we sell, billet and Superior, have the same margins to our dealers as always. The only ones that don't are the 3 same as Sikk products that we sell. We ourselves don't buy direct from the factory, we buy our parts from Superior. But maybe, when this is all said and done, I'll just give everyone the name and number of the factory in Taiwan, so that everyone can buy at the same price!